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Bad Golf: Community Edition
Posted: 10 February 2014 01:25 PM
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During the AF2014 finalist reveal, after it became clear that Bad Golf 2 was out, an idea about a community-made Bad Golf 2 during Amnesia Fortnight 2014 was thrown into the chat. After Patrick heard about this he said:

PatrickHackett - 10 February 2014 12:37 PM
Lasd - 10 February 2014 12:35 PM

Someone on Twitch chat suggested that the community should make a Bad Golf 2 during the Amnesia Fortnight. It was a funny and great idea, so I wanted to mention it somewhere where it doesn’t instantly disappear.

OH MY GOD.
Pleeeaaaaaaase do this.  I will help in any way I can.
Yes yes yes, this is awesome.

The people in this community have the skills necessary to make this happen. It might not be that pretty, but it would definitely be really cool.

So, who’s up for making Bad Golf 2 together?

Development has started!

- GitHub repository
- Wiki with ideas
- Things left to do

Come say hi to us in IRC:
Server: irc.foonetic.net
Channel: #BadGolf2

Or just click here.


Development updates by Cheeseness (and some screenshots by me):
#1: Setting up
#1 Bonus: Humble beginnings
#2: Getting started
#3: Concept art and code
#3 Bonus: Carts and menu
#4: Mockups, models and first build
#5: More amazing mockups and models
#6: Fancy test course and grumpy Patrick model
#7: Animation videos and a gorgeous shot of the course
#8: Minimap and Tim
#9: Dynamic models, waterfalls, sweet UI elements and Tim
#10: Behind the scenes work and news round-up
#11: Fortnight build!
#12: New models, carts and courses
#13: UI and animation
#14: New build and whole load of concept art
#15: Another build! Sweet splashcreens, Anna and Pendleton
#16: Winning
#17: Online golfing, end of Amnesia Fortnight build, Dave and Raz
#18: Going forward
#19: Modeling and coding in the post-AF world
#20: Online winning
#21: IRC meeting, bits and pieces
#22: Sweet new build


Build:
Newest build (26th of May)

[ Edited: 26 May 2014 12:41 PM by Lasd ]
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Posted: 10 February 2014 01:29 PM
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Continued from first post:

Bad Golf coverage:
Mentioned on “February Mojo Tidbits” (MixnMojo February 21st)
Double Fine Fans Developing Rejected Amnesia Fortnight Prototype (IGN February 22nd)
Bad Golf reborn as Double Fine community project (IncGamers February 23rd)
Rejected Amnesia Fortnite prototype Bad Golf 2 is getting made by fans (Polygon February 24th)
Fans are making Double Fine’s rejected pitch Bad Golf 2 (Eurogamer February 24th)
Fans are bringing an unused Double Fine pitch to life (Destructoid February 24th)
Double Fine fans unite to develop scrapped Amnesia Fortnight game (Gamasutra February 24th)
If Double Fine won’t make Bad Golf 2, fans will (PC Gamer February 24th)
Unselected Amnesia Fortnight pitch, Bad Golf 2, picked up by fans to get developed (Start Button Gaming February 24th)
Double Fine fans receive permission to develop rejected Amnesia Fortnight pitch (VG247 February 25th)
Double Fine approves fan use of Bad Golf 2 IP (Shoost February 25th)
Double Fine’s Unused ‘Bad Golf 2′ Idea Being Made By Fans (Rock, Paper, Shotgun February 25th)
Segment in Day 4 of Amnesia Fortnight Documentary (2 Player Productions February 25th)
Demolish your friends’ balls (and carts) in Bad Golf 2 (Wired February 25th)
Fans are developing Double Fine’s rejected ‘Bad Golf 2′ (Pixels for Breakfast February 25th)
Double Fine Fans Receive Permission to Make Rejected Golf Title (Arcade Sushi February 25th
Bad Golf 2 to be developed by fans (Sportra February 25th)
Amnesia Fortnight 2014: Early Challenges and The Return Of Bad Golf 2 (Leviathyn February 25th)
14 days into the project, Bad Golf 2 gets new update (Shoost February 26th)
Cheeseness interviewed on the AF livestream (Double Fine/2 Player Productions February 28th)
Bad Golf: Community Edition Interview (Leviathyn February 28th)
Erik Behar representing the community in the official AF stream (Double Fine/2 Player Productions March 4th)
Double Fine Unchains Game IP, Fans Work To Make The Game For Them (TechDirt March 17th)


—————————————

Decided to separate this from the OP. I can code and I’ve made a prototype project on Unity. I pretty much don’t have any artistic skills.

I could also help with organizing this thing. Make documents, set up version control and things like that.

[ Edited: 17 March 2014 05:50 PM by Lasd ]
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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:24 PM
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I can’t do anything game related, but I do support this idea wholeheartedly.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:28 PM
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Though im not that good (and im probably being nice on this point) at creating art, i do know some programing languages though not much c++ (unless we are talking console mode, which we aren’t), so i’d help out on that.

And like Lasd i have been messing with unity.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:36 PM
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Oh, that’s nice… but just to be the annoying guy, mind the IP guys. The game concept belongs to Patrick Hackett and Double Fine. I suppose it should be quite easy to obtain some kind of licence from them (Patrick seemed very enthusiastic about a community-made BG2). Yes, I know, this kind of thing kinda spoils the fun, but it’s better to start of on the right foot.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:38 PM
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doublezero - 10 February 2014 02:36 PM

(Patrick seemed very enthusiastic about a community-made BG2)

Could you please not use that acronym? wink

BTW, you guys are awesome. I personally never had any interest in Bad Golf 1 or 2 but the kind of enthusiasm you show is just a delight to watch smile I hope you can pull this off!

By posting below this you automatically agree to be reassigned to new projects for the duration of this Amnesia Fortnight.

[ Edited: 13 February 2014 04:15 PM by mudd1 ]
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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:42 PM
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Unity would be the easiest way to do it. Iºm no expert but I can try to do sounds if the project goes forward.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:46 PM
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I love this idea.  Go get ‘em!

@doublezero Patrick said he’d help, and as long as everyone just lets it go after AF is over it’s no harm.  Right?

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Posted: 10 February 2014 02:56 PM
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Being Patricks idea, its his IP not the company (i think) unless they decided to prototype and go foward with it, but only patrick, tim or the others could say.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 03:12 PM
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i have done some things, but i have already too many projects, maybe…. i would like to go in to help sometimes, and boost morale!

twitch? what?

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Posted: 10 February 2014 03:14 PM
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also, ideas and mecanhics cant be patented, its not like they are going to sue us for a community made small free indie game…. we should go forward with this, it will be awesome!

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Posted: 10 February 2014 03:21 PM
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Goldenheaven - 10 February 2014 02:56 PM

Being Patricks idea, its his IP not the company (i think) unless they decided to prototype and go foward with it, but only patrick, tim or the others could say.

Not for sure, but I think all the videos have DF claiming them at the end.  Many creative companies require employees to only make things on behalf of the company, like all of Levi’s Black Lake art had DF copyright on them.  He can add them to his portfolio, but he can’t sell the idea away or make it on his own.

A similar thing that Saturday Night Live has is an archive of every sketch ever written by their writers.  Not just what made it to air, but ALL of the rejected sketches as well.  Sorry for OT.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 03:41 PM
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Don’t think they mind if its community he even said he would love it if it would happen.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 03:47 PM
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Well, yeah, sorry for derailing the thread with such a mood-killer topic. The thing is, I own IP. And while I’m not aware of U.S. IP law in particular, I know that about everywhere in the world it follows the “enforce it or lose it” principle. That means that, if the just ignore a community-produced Bad Golf 2, then latter, let’s say, EA, can claim that the concept is now in “public domain” and make their own version.

Then again, perhaps I am worried over nothing. Patrick, could you clear this up?

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Posted: 10 February 2014 03:57 PM
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doublezero - 10 February 2014 03:47 PM

Well, yeah, sorry for derailing the thread with such a mood-killer topic. The thing is, I own IP. And while I’m not aware of U.S. IP law in particular, I know that about everywhere in the world it follows the “enforce it or lose it” principle. That means that, if the just ignore a community-produced Bad Golf 2, then latter, let’s say, EA, can claim that the concept is now in “public domain” and make their own version.

Then again, perhaps I am worried over nothing. Patrick, could you clear this up?


If he read his contract, knows of anything stopping this from happening he could tell us or talks to tim directly he could.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 04:08 PM
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How about, for the time being, just use a code name like “Bad Gawlf To”

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Posted: 10 February 2014 04:09 PM
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“Enforce it or lose it” is an aspect of Trademark law, not Copyright. Copyright is assigned (in the US, certainly, but most of the world as well) as soon as something is put into a fixed form. The Copyright applies to the specific implementation of an idea (the exact words in a story, the exact art, the exact musical performance), not to the idea itself. Concepts are always in the public domain, specific implementations of those concepts (esp. characters, settings, and events specific to an IP) are always copyrighted. Copyright doesn’t go away if someone rips you off, or if you license your IP, it only goes away after a set period of time. (Life plus 70 years if an individual retains Copyright, 90 years from first publication if a company does.)

For purposes of Copyright, any elements of “Bad Golf” and “Bad Golf 2” which have been shown/recorded/distributed as part of the AF videos would certainly be considered “published”. Additionally, any design documents which exist are technically also Copyrighted as well (though not considered published, which has a bearing if there needs to be a trial later, but not for determining the term or existence of Copyright), and will remain so for the rest of our lives.

Unfortunately, from what I understand of the “Bad Golf” concept, there isn’t much there which would be protected by Copyright. Golf itself is in the public domain, as is the sort of behavior described; Patrick doesn’t own much, there, from what I’ve seen. In which case: Trademark may actually be the only part which might apply, and it wouldn’t come into effect until the name “Bad Golf” is registered for use as a video game title—and then we can come back to the “enforce it or lose it” principle; if Patrick/DF have established the “Bad Golf” Trademark and want to retain it, the community project cannot use the name “Bad Golf”. Otherwise, yes, EA could theoretically use the name “Bad Golf” and defend themselves by showing the Trademark was not defended.

But it’s just the name. Not the concept. There’s nothing I’m aware of about Bad Golf which would prevent EA (or anyone else) from making their own version of the concept.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 04:15 PM
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modernevil - 10 February 2014 04:09 PM

“Enforce it or lose it” is an aspect of Trademark law, not Copyright.

Yes, I know, that’s why I placed everything under an “IP” umbrella term smile

Oh boy, I did it, I turned a game design discussion into a legalese one… My sincere apologies, Goldenheaven is right, if Patrick has any concern, he’ll have us know.

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Posted: 10 February 2014 04:56 PM
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I had a friend which belonged to a magic the gathering unauthorized pc game, the game was made by fans, and since it was so good it was all locked down against leaking, the only people that had access to it was the Community of the developers. I have no trouble doing that, its actually awesome… more or less, the important part is the process of making the game, and if we can, put in places like indie db. Someone should make like a subforum here in these double fine forums, and we should try to come with a nice idea for the design, and the work flow agenda organization stuff, we could play safe and make a comuintty take on the concept…. i am totally down for it…

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Posted: 10 February 2014 05:54 PM
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STOP WITH THE BUSINESS TALK.  the first post was so awesome and then the replies are “intellectual property rights” bla bla bla….Patrick said yes and was happy….why are the replies so business focused and boring.  AHhhhhhhh!!!!!!!


Anyways.


I could do any and all sound that is needed, whatever people want.  Record samples of anything.  Music.  I’m that guy.  Definitely if anyone else wants to do sound or any of that stuff, cool, but if it is simply a situation where we need someone to do something, I can and will be able to do all of it….in terms of sound and music! raspberry


and quit it with changing the subject and talking about copyright law and stuff, like do you have a soul?


BAD GOLF 2
BAD GOLF 2
!!!!!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!

edit:  indiebeardstand, is that you above me? raspberry

[ Edited: 10 February 2014 06:00 PM by jasondesante ]
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Sept 21,2014
Justin Bailey banned me and then called me a dick because I thought it was funny the moderators didn’t understand a message that I and many other people all repeated.  I posted its funny no ones getting the hint yet, he bans and calls me a dick. 
Personally targeted attacks brought to you by Double Fine.

Now I cant see the 2PP doc of Broken Age, which makes things more interesting.
stop power trippin unban me plz

I want refunds for SpaceBase,BrokenAge+MassiveChalice plz

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Posted: 10 February 2014 06:16 PM
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jasondesante - 10 February 2014 05:54 PM

STOP WITH THE BUSINESS TALK.  the first post was so awesome and then the replies are “intellectual property rights” bla bla bla….Patrick said yes and was happy….why are the replies so business focused and boring.  AHhhhhhhh!!!!!!!


Anyways.


I could do any and all sound that is needed, whatever people want.  Record samples of anything.  Music.  I’m that guy.  Definitely if anyone else wants to do sound or any of that stuff, cool, but if it is simply a situation where we need someone to do something, I can and will be able to do all of it….in terms of sound and music! raspberry


and quit it with changing the subject and talking about copyright law and stuff, like do you have a soul?


BAD GOLF 2
BAD GOLF 2
!!!!!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!

edit:  indiebeardstand, is that you above me? raspberry

Because people are afraid of lawsuits, regardless of how well intentioned you are, of how much would it cost (free or not), you can still get one of those above your head as if it was a huge crosshair and then suddently that game you made just got you a new home under the bridge.

Still thats not a discution we should be having as its not up to us, as i said earlier this is patrick’s/doublefine’s decision, await for an answer or a new sub forum as it would signal aprovement.

[ Edited: 10 February 2014 06:32 PM by Goldenheaven ]
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Posted: 10 February 2014 06:24 PM
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ahhhhh

lawsuits from where?  holy moly guacamole!

theres a lot of really cool fanmade pokemon games that are free and also take donations.  people appreciate awesomeness.  that is why I feel that getting into the whole business poop is ruining this moment right now just like throwing the message that they’re trying hard to figure out a way to make more money this Amnesia Fortnight so it is profitable ended up clouding the message that people who appreciate awesomeness need to check out Amnesia Fortnight.  Does that make any sense? 

Should someone make a new thread so positive thoughts can be collected there regarding this awesome idea?  because this is just getting a little too depressing that I’m not sure if it will even start now.

Seriously thinking about that stuff before you even make something….it reminds me of going to a friends house to jam and they couldn’t do anything and then after getting them to play a single song they want to stop jamming, and then start talking about how we should make a myspace page and stuff (yea it was that long ago).  anyways, getting too far ahead of yourself is a problem and thats what I think is happening right now. 

lets just do it

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Sept 21,2014
Justin Bailey banned me and then called me a dick because I thought it was funny the moderators didn’t understand a message that I and many other people all repeated.  I posted its funny no ones getting the hint yet, he bans and calls me a dick. 
Personally targeted attacks brought to you by Double Fine.

Now I cant see the 2PP doc of Broken Age, which makes things more interesting.
stop power trippin unban me plz

I want refunds for SpaceBase,BrokenAge+MassiveChalice plz

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Posted: 10 February 2014 06:38 PM
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jasondesante - 10 February 2014 06:24 PM

Should someone make a new thread so positive thoughts can be collected there regarding this awesome idea?  because this is just getting a little too depressing that I’m not sure if it will even start now.

Aw man… I ruined it?

jasondesante - 10 February 2014 06:24 PM

lets just do it

HELL YEAH!!

BAD GOLF 2!
BAD GOLF 2!
BAD GOLF 2!

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Posted: 10 February 2014 06:41 PM
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jasondesante - 10 February 2014 06:24 PM

ahhhhh

lawsuits from where?  holy moly guacamole!

theres a lot of really cool fanmade pokemon games that are free and also take donations.  people appreciate awesomeness.  that is why I feel that getting into the whole business poop is ruining this moment right now just like throwing the message that they’re trying hard to figure out a way to make more money this Amnesia Fortnight so it is profitable ended up clouding the message that people who appreciate awesomeness need to check out Amnesia Fortnight.  Does that make any sense? 

Should someone make a new thread so positive thoughts can be collected there regarding this awesome idea?  because this is just getting a little too depressing that I’m not sure if it will even start now.

Seriously thinking about that stuff before you even make something….it reminds me of going to a friends house to jam and they couldn’t do anything and then after getting them to play a single song they want to stop jamming, and then start talking about how we should make a myspace page and stuff (yea it was that long ago).  anyways, getting too far ahead of yourself is a problem and thats what I think is happening right now. 

lets just do it

Doing as you please.

People we need the following:

Artists ( we need people to create textures/meshes/concept art)
Sound Guys (we seem to have one)
Graphics Programmer
Programmer (If unity i can do with c#, python or javascript)
Patrick raspberry
Probably Some else i might be forgetting.

Are we going to use unity?
What tools are we gonna use? (ex: maya,3ds, blender, propeller, maybe some photoshop?!?)
Are we going to create a story behind it for single player ( or let madness float xD)
Are we doing multiplayer?
What version of unity should we use (free vs pro)?
What gameplay features will we be adding?
So on…

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Posted: 10 February 2014 06:50 PM
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You guys are amazing, so wonderfully amazing

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HEY: @bburbank / @jetgirlghostdog

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Posted: 10 February 2014 07:36 PM
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Maybe someday we will work with awesome people like you guys. xD

One day i’d hope to be in a AF.

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